Sam Vakin's Help to Us All

Narcissistic personality disorder
#62

I’ve never done this before, but I consider CZBZ one of the treasures of this board, and its a bloody shame anyone should be giving her a hard time, let alone someone who claims they want to help as B has so often stated.

I have not yet, until now ever shared a private communication publicly.

But I’d like to make it known, I tried to make peace with B and start the process of neutralizing what seemed to be a growing level of rancor on this board.

This is what I got from B for my peacekeeping efforts:
“Perhaps I should just be very honest with you. Over the past few days you have absolutely convinced me that you are self centered, extremely manipulative, and basically a complete phony.
Now, what are you actually after?
GD”

I’ve had nasty responses like this to my generousity before, but not by anyone over the age of 18, except my exN.

I think I’ve made it pretty clear what I have always been after - getting and giving support, mutual respect and at least tonight, empathy.

There is no ulterior motive, I really dont suspect that CZBZ has one either. Its very easy to take some people at their word…and others, are like a bag of snakes - woe to be to anyone who puts their hand into it.

I’m sorry I ever did.

I’m sorry to say B, you have eroded any credibility you may have had by turning on not me, but on board members who arent handmaidens, but respectable, gracious, caring women who think for themselves.

What do you think? if this useless obsession with fighting anyone and everyone no matter where they are on the recovery road doesnt stop, maybe we could start turning deaf ears?

It seems to work just fine with N’s, maybe it could work with B’s too?

#63

Yeah I saw that Susiejo…

Looks more like a practical joke than an actual sock puppet though.

Incidentally you realise all the capering on this thread probably isn’t goading as such…it’s more likely to be trying to “drown out” everything I said in the hope that not many of the real people actually bother to see it.

They go through the same routines over and over and honestly believe nobody recognise what they are doing…

If it wasn’t so destructive it would be hilarious.

GD

#64

"and I was just trying to remember who ELSE, apart from CZBZ tried that "putting words in my mouth" thing recently too..." 

Think really, really hard on that point, okay? Put all your mental energies into thinking about who put words in your mouth 'cuz it's such an important thing to obsess on, after all.

Actually, it's prolly a relief to obsess on Word-Putters and get your mind off SAM VAKNIN for awhile. ;-)

LOL

CZ

 

 

#65

Yes I did write that, and you will notice 3 things:

  1. it wasnt at all relevant to what my last post regarded
  2. it is indeed true, unless you yourself edited your own posts from the past, you did say you were not goin g to stand idly by and let Sam con victims of abuse without saying something
  3. that the part I edited, my own words were respectful and generous towards YOU

I no longer expect the same from you, i’ve come to realize its quite an impossible expectation to ahve with you.

And so as I also said in my private exchange with you, I said my piece, my side of the road is clean, I offered peace with good will.

What happened since then is for the most part your doing. What you feel you need to keep yourself from being conned by me about I have no idea. I’m not selling or marketing a damn thing, I’m just here working through my process out loud with other folks who are doing the same. It never occured to me that a survivor of abuse looking to get and give support to fellow survivors could be seen as threatening, but go with that, follow your interest. My exN partner could never understand why someone who was being abused would fight for better treatment, he just always thought I was being demanding.

The behaviours seem quite similar.

I’d have plenty more to say because I’m “in a state”, however, all the venom and bile I have is really not meant for you, I dont know you, and I wont let you become the surrogate for someone who really does deserve to be punished.

Go to bed, get some sleep, tomorrows a new day.

#66

you’re a bully

I know you dont think you are

but you are

and really, I say this softly and with heart

the last thing this forum of survivors of abusive relationships needs is one more bully

I hope you understand what I’m saying

the survivors dont need another bully

if you really did experience abuse in your lifetime then I think you’ll know precisely what I’m saying

bully the abusers, go ahead - I wish I could give you ex’s phone number (if he hadnt changed it)
dont bully the survivors

because then youre just perpetuating the abuse

#67

Phoenix,

The only context WAS that you were trying to manipulate me by twisting my words, with a view to forcing some kind of pretence at an alliance neither of us actually feels.

You are now throwing a tantrum, and anything else handy, same as you did with Samvak (well you sure as hell don’t act out as any kind of moral judgement) same as you do to anyone who won’t pander to your ego and play along with you…

Makes it really easy for anyone who can be bothered, to play you like a fish on a line…until they don’t have any use for you.

But I guess you’ll need to grow and develope a whole lot more before your see that for yourself?

You never did say what school of Psychotherapy you studied.

CZBZ

Are you modelling this season’s new compassion or this season’s new empathy right now…

Either way, I can’t see it catching on.

GD

#68

Dear Blitzen,

My hope is to see more forums on the Internet, not fewer.

Every message board has a style, a certain je ne sais quois, (I don't know latin but I do speak french), an atmosphere particular to the group sharing their lives with one another. Seeing CarePlace members suffer even more than they already have, compelled me to finally speak up.

Unless you haven't noticed, fewer and fewer people are participating on this board. Fewer and fewer people dare comment or feel safe enough to talk about the reasons why they were looking for support when they found this forum. Rather than encouraging people to discuss the NPD as a potential explanation for a partner's behavior, people have been silenced.

There's a story that came to mind when I was deciding whether or not to post on this forum since I rarely post on other people's boards. I certainly had no intentions of involving myself with an irresolvable dispute between yourself and Sam Vaknin.

The story I remembered goes like this:

"A fat man leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time, high tide will be upon them and unless he is unstuck, they will all be drowned except for the fat man, whose head is out of the cave.

"Fortunately, someone has a stick of dynamite in his pocket. (Don't ask me why someone would carry a stick of dynamite but that's how the story goes.)

"There seems to be no way to get the fat man loose without using that stick of dynamite which will inevitably kill the guy. But if they do not use it, everyone will drown."

So I've been kind and gentle and patient and I've talked with you at length already. But eventually, if you don't move yourself out of the way, somebody is gonna light a fire.

Tell me Blitzen---what is more compassionate? Listening to one person go on and on without resolution or empathy for her negative impact on the group? OR extending human compassion to the group and nudging a lone reindeer out of the airspace?

In this case, I might appeal to your compassion for those who have asked Kindly, for you to think about others rather than your own agenda. I do believe most of us have heard you and some have even agreed with your perceptions. But when a forum is destroyed because of one person's vitriole against Vaknin, what have you accomplished?

I hope you hear kindness from me concerning your experience; but there are much better ways to be heard than attacking, criticising, demeaning and hurting fellow board members.

CZBZ

You can read about other ethical dilemmas here: http://www.friesian.com/valley/dilemmas.htm#1

 

 

#69

Well that header DID say:

"Sam Vakin’s Help to Us All”

If you weren’t expecting to see yours truly, and a mystery white knight, mudwrestling, live online, with fanatical Samvak devotees, devious Samvak handmaidens, an host of sockpuppets and one screaming histrionic who basically just wants to get into Sam Vaknin’s shreddies and/or dominate the known world…

I would LOVE to know what the feck you DID expect to see?

:o)

GD

PS. I wonder what will happen when they all realize that this site is available to logins only…there is no google, no audience of anonymous IPs…just us…

#70

CZBZ,

I reckon Jim Jones used most of that argument to justify his warm loving community in Guyana…

NEWSFLASH

Creating toxic cultlike communities that revictimise vulnerable people so that you can gratify your need for a warm fuzzy sense of dysfunctional dominance is not a behavior I would consider to be on the side of the angels.

I saw through you years ago…literally…and on this board you have gone on reinforcing that day after day.

Only thing I am not sure of is whether you are actually a sockpuppet of Femfree using a little inverted psychology for “the cause” or just a clone…

Either way…

You don’t fool me.

wink

GD

#71

"PS. I wonder what will happen when they all realize that this site is available to logins only...there is no google, no audience of anonymous IPs...just us... "

What ARE you talking about??? Who are 'they' and what does anonymous IPs have to do with anything or even google??

CZ

#72

CZ, Ladies,

I have been reading for about a week now. Hope you don’t mind me chiming in.

CZ, yes it is sad when a message board is blown apart by a choice few. A lot of work, time, and caring goes into “most” of them.

I am not as patient as CZ, never have been…lol
I am about deleting/banning garbage from my own forum, period. But I don’t presume to tell anyone else how to run their forum.

CZ and I have had our differences of opinions over the yrs, but not once have we had to stoop to “garbage”.

I do not care for SV, but 5 yrs ago he was the easiest read out there. As more info has become available, we no longer use his work at all. And SV is NOT allowed on my forum. And neither is his counterpart. As a matter of fact, she was banned 5 yrs ago for flaming. (non-SV related, just for fun)

I also recall reading a while back, by her own hand, that she was going to let the SV thing go. Yet, when I came here, I saw it was not so, as I had figured to begin with.

This kind of stuff only serves to destroy forums meant to help people. Then it gets to the point that some are pushed even closer to SV by it. Lesser of 2 evils, so to speak…lol

It’s purely self serving. And as Forrest would say…That is all I got to say about that…lol

Sandahl

ps…Mam…good idea. :wink:

#73

I swear to God, Blitzen---you sound just like my X. That man checked the cinnamon on his buns for arsenic.

Have you read the book "Mistakes were made but not by me?" Seems folks SEE what they want to SEE. At least according to Carol Tavris.

If you're looking for dishonesty, you'll see it in me. If you're looking for deception, you'll see it in me. If you're looking for a liar to discredit my integrity and thereby diminish my credibility...guess what? You'll see it in me.

Doesn't make it true though it may appear to be very real to you.

I'm not here to convince you of my integrity. Hell, I couldn't even do that with my own husbaNd of thirty years. LOL

CZBZ

 

#74

I've noticed one thing, we, who are putting energy into trying to maintain a supportive evironment for survivors no matter which book, philosophy or experience they hold are being consistently accused of things that she herself is creating:

Creating a toxic community

revictimising vulnerable people

gratifying a need for dysfunctional dominance

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(I'm going to stop there).

I'm voting we put energy into what we did come here for ...mutual support no matter where each other is on their path, and a certain level of respect.

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I really really want that for myself and the rest of you.

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I'm going to bed now, but in the morning, I'm hoping to have something supportive and constructive to offer the members who want that.

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Any kind of participation with B seems to create the opposite of what I would like to support. I guess I had to keep wiggling that loose tooth until it finally fell out.

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#75

CZBZ,

Actually I have a very open mind to people…

Your manipulative behavior and disregard for facts is is blatant, your lack of scruples and taste for control are fairly obvious assumptions…

It’s hardly my fault that you don’t fool me now is it?

Sandahl…we never really met but that is largely because it has been so blatantly obvious that you are also either a sockpuppet, or a clone, of Femfree for even longer…

Certainly wouldn’t have surprised me for a long time if you and CZBZ are the same person…

Same type of false logic, same patterns…but I can only analyse what I can see, I’m not psychic…

Anyway, whatever, either you, or the pair of you, should have the sense to recognize that whoever the old adage “If you tell a lie long enough it will become the truth” applies to convincing it never has, and never will, apply to convincing me.

Now we have all cleared the air I think I will leave you to carry on this particular, rather artificially induced, flame war between you…

GD

#76

"Now we have all cleared the air I think I will leave you to carry on... " ~Blitzen 

Does this mean you're moving out of the cave so we can all breath again??

Just wondering....

CZBZ, liar, cheat, sockpuppet, clone, creepy woman, nasty woman, Jim Jones groupie, manipulator, con-artist, lousy writer, unscrupulous, flaming retard, control freakish, warm-and-fuzzy-enabler, marshmallow brain, etc. But one thing I am NOT, is Sandahl.

ROFLMAO!

#77

CZ,

“But one thing I am NOT, is Sandahl.”

I almost sprayed my screen with coffee on that one…LMAO!!!

Damn!
If people only knew how NOT the same we are…LOL

Yet, see how we can get along. No garbage, heh. :wink:

Sand

#78

Can I just say…

I have been praying my mind could turn to Eternal-Sunshine-of-a-Spotless-Mind-kind-of-mush for quite awhile now.

It is NOT fair that CZ is the marshmallow head here.

I demand justice.

#79

P,

Would Jello be a good second choice??? :wink:
I got Puddin’…lol

Sand

#80

will it be painful?

promise me you’ll be gentle, thats all.

#81

RUN, FORREST, RUUUUN!!! :slight_smile: